Gamedata Makes a difference in AI

[Littleware]

Yesterday, I tested the game quality by switching out gamedata files. My test used the gamedata files from each of the completed mods from XIII-XV. I even tried the Heisman11 gamedata. All were used with the same set of sliders.

What I found was that using the modified dat files caused the scores to be drastically lower, and the game play disfunctional. I saw from XV (5 CPU v CPU games) 26-17, 23-20, 17-3, 22-16, 19-10. XIV CPU v CPU 10-6, 9-3, 16-10, tons of 3-N-outs (scores were so low I couldn't stand to watch again). XIII were higher with scores in the mid twenties, 31-17, 34-20, 23-20, 19-10, 24-14. With only two teams scoring over 29 points. The Heisman dat produced similar numbers to the XIV dat in cpu v cpu games (completely unwatchable).

The default gamedata out performed the others by far. Even though the books are dated, the flow of play from both teams was 90% better. I had 4 comeback victories where teams were down at the half and pulled it out late. I had three blowouts 31-10, 24-6, 44-3. The Saints v Cardinals produced 44-38 OT. Scores look more normal! I prefer to have a better game flow, than just updated formations and playbooks that the CPU doesn't utilize correctly! Most games only had 5-6 punts per team and very few 3-n-outs!

[NickyJ]

I've always preferred the default gamedata file, just because I'm familiar with the playbooks. That said, all the mods use the same updated gamedata file (from Madden 09 PS2, if I remember correctly), so it isn't the gamedata file that changed the different mods' results. Are you sure you weren't using different rosters from each mod?

[Littleware]

I've always preferred the default gamedata file, just because I'm familiar with the playbooks. That said, all the mods use the same updated gamedata file (from Madden 09 PS2, if I remember correctly), so it isn't the gamedata file that changed the different mods' results. Are you sure you weren't using different rosters from each mod?

First, I stated I switched gamedata files, not rosters or mods... Now, did you know that if you have Madden 07, the gamedata from it works with Madden 08, but the 06 gamedata crashes to desktop?!? With that Each mod's gamedata file has been tinkered with! And I'm sure it wasn't just a cut-N-paste type of deal from the Ps2 version!

And what point would it be to switch them in the FI-FX mods if they were the same?!?!

Sounds like you're just giving a generic opinion, since you don't remember correctly!

[NickyJ]

The console Madden version that it came out with, I don't remember. That it's always the same one used, I know for certain. If you check the dates that each gamedata file was lasted edited from each mod, they will all say January 16th, 2011. If they were different gamedata files, they would each list a different date of when they were last edited.

The gamedata files were not changed for each mod. Only one gamedata file was taken from a console game, and each mod has that one gamedata file included. The file is untouched from each version.

As for Madden 06 and 07/08, I suspect the reason for that is related to the pre-defined, pre-snap player motions. In Madden 06, whenever you wanted a player to be sent in motion, you would have to select him yourself, then manually tell him to move. Madden 07 and 08 both have certain plays that are designed for the player go in motion as soon as you press the button to snap the ball. It was particularly annoying for me because I preferred New England's playbook in Madden 06, but a number of the plays I preferred were replaced by the pre-snap motion plays.

Anyway, no need to be rude about it. As someone who helped with each mod release, I'm familiar with what files were added and used. It's also something that is easily checked, as I listed above, by checking the date modified listing of each gamedata file.

[moonbax]

So, what else is in Gamedata.dat besides the playbooks, anyone know? I know 1-38 is defense, 41-79 is offense (41-72 seems to be the team specific ones), but since there are 113 files there might be other modifiable things in there of interest. Maybe even pre-snap stuff as Nicky said. Or, what if there is some special teams data in there somewhere too, are those separate plays from offense and defense?

[NickyJ]

Thinking back, another reason 06's gamedata file doesn't work might be related to the number of defensive playbooks. In 08, each team has its own defensive playbook, catered just to that team. In 06, teams had a selection of only a small handful: 4-3, 3-4, 46, plus maybe a couple more; each team would then be assigned one of those few playbooks.

I wouldn't think that would be a problem, since with graphical dat files, portrait packs are compatible only with older versions because each pack was smaller than the previous version. But Madden works in mysterious ways, so I really don't know. I wish 06's gamedata file did work with 08, though. I really want to try that NE playbook again.

[Littleware]

Moonbax, it would be great to dissect the gamedata to see if there are any other elements to be modified.

Nicky, I have 6 gamedata files, including the games original which has a date of 6-6-2007. two of them have the date you listed 01-16-2011.
06-03-2012, 03-08-15, 04-27-16 (my modified gamedata) are the other dates.

Whats weird about the 06 dat file crash is, my Trickeration Playbook was originally created in Madden 06, works perfect as a custom book in 08 if you've tried it! Also I've imported it into the above listed gamedata and cpu teams run it just fine, no crashes. So there are some elements from 06 that can be used in 08. I did purchase 07 back in 2011 ($8) when I thought of using/importing some of those books in 08! Never loaded it!

I also played NFL Head Coach 09. It uses the 06 game engine, and has a cool enhanced speech engine where in-game you can either select/call the plays or you take advice from your coordinators as if their communicating from the booth to your headset!! I'd love to have the OC and DC speech in Madden 08! It even has ESPN's Trey Wingo doing some commentating!

As far as my testing goes, the results are concluded! I've seen enough from the other mod's dats! They have pretty exotic formations to look at! To often in the past, when trying to create a playbook using the 01-16-11 dat, Madden crashed to desktop is the reason I started using the default dat again!

Edit: Nicky, if you want, I'll send you the 06 dat file. Export or re-create the books you like for use in 08!

[TheRareButter]

I also played NFL Head Coach 09. It uses the 06 game engine, and has a cool enhanced speech engine where in-game you can either select/call the plays or you take advice from your coordinators as if their communicating from the booth to your headset!! I'd love to have the OC and DC speech in Madden 08! It even has ESPN's Trey Wingo doing some commentating!

That would be cool, the coordinator speech is one of my favorite aspects of HC06. Honestly baffles me that they didn't integrate it for Superstar mode for QB's. It'd be just like how coordinators and QBs communicate play calling in real life, the radio directly into the helmet. I'll see what can be done with that when I've got some time actually, the terms the OC says doesn't necessarily line up with the actual call so as long as it can be distinguished between run and passing plays it would be awesome for superstar.

So you're saying that the GAMEDATA file effects gameplay AI? Meaning that if i had the 08 and 11 Gamedata files, and each of them had the exact same playbooks they would play differently from each other?

Does anyone have the 07 GAMEDATA? I've been told that Madden 07 had the best gameplay.

[Rixster67r]

It is my opinion that the DB Template should not be edited at all except for what absolutely needs to be fixed...... and I am thinking that is a stadium issue is the only thing....

At one point I discovered that I could just destroy the cpu using any other playbook than the defaults and that the cpu AI was horrible with any other playbook than the default including the balanced, run heavy, etc playbooks

Work arounds should be encouraged for anything else......

[TheRareButter]

It is my opinion that the DB Template should not be edited at all except for what absolutely needs to be fixed...... and I am thinking that is a stadium issue is the only thing....

At one point I discovered that I could just destroy the cpu using any other playbook than the defaults and that the cpu AI was horrible with any other playbook than the default including the balanced, run heavy, etc playbooks

Work arounds should be encouraged for anything else......

Do the GAMEDATA files effect the DB templates somehow?